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Necronomicon Draft packs

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54 replies to this topic

#41
Tragic

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for me the entire attraction of the LCG over traditional TCGs is that there is no randomization in the cards. Yes there are some games (like ANR for exaple that are very young) where you are constantly swapping out cards between your decks and would love to have a second or 3rd set of jackson Howard or w/e. These "can" be gained though draft packs. Still. As it is a LCG you can just buy the pack they came in and get it right off the bat. So for me the idea that you gain extra cards is not a good thing. I think it is a bad thing. Having 1 random card you want doesn't help.. you would need to be lucky enough to get it 3 times. For that cost.. just buy the original pack! Also OCD collectors like me dislike only having 4 of a card instead of 6!

The real solution is to wait until the draft pool is discovered by the fans or released by FFG and then just make the entire pool as a draft cube from your personal collection. All the fun , non of the cost.

#42
Jhaelen

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Well, considering I typically get to play CoC at most once a week, I don't mind not being able to play draft weekly ;)

For me it's something for special occasions. I wouldn't play it regularly, so the price point isn't prohibitive.

 

What to do with the extra cards when I'm done drafting is another question, though...



#43
dboeren

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for me the entire attraction of the LCG over traditional TCGs is that there is no randomization in the cards.

 

Agreed.  When I have tried CCGs I tend to get frustrated that other players have decks loaded up with powerful Rare/Epic/Legendary cards that I don't have access to.  A duel should be a contest of skill, not of who got luckier opening packs or spent more money.

 

L5R taught me that if you don't pump a lot of money into the game not only is your deck weak, but you can't really take part in the forum discussions either because the threads are all about the good stuff.

 

Solforge taught me that it doesn't HAVE to be that bad.  They seem to be generous enough with the packs that a free player who does their daily quests diligently can get a pretty decent collection over time.

 

Hearthstone seems to be a lot more stingy with free stuff than Solforge but to be fair I just recently started playing so I should probably give it some more time and see how it goes.  However, I seem to run into a lot of people who obviously have MUCH better card collections than I do, even at low ranks.



#44
Tragic

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how can any self respecting card game player play hearthstone? It is just glorified snap. Has a card play a card. Your entire decision option is just about if you do or do not play it as soon as it comes into your hand. It boggles my mind that this game is so popular!

 

There is Duels of Champions I've tried and while it is not as childish as hearthstone it is not far from it. It at least has some interesting spells and stuff, but it is still just a variant of drop a monster, attack with that monster. Though the positioning data and the spells at least make it a "real" card game over Hearthstone.

 

The big problem with all the computer game card games is that there is no way to disrupt your oponant during their turn. No cancels, interrupts, or other surprise actions that change the game state after plans have been formed. It is so static. Mindless even.

 

You know as a test I completed the hearthstone 2nd tier campaign (after the basic ones) for the warrior by just casting what ever card was on the far left of the screen. No thinking, nothing.. Just click on the left of the screen. I lost 2 games! I tried this in 1v1 vs a human and lost 2 and won 4. That game is just stoopid!!

 

Haven't tried Soulforge... I'll give it a go.



#45
Yipe

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how can any self respecting card game player play hearthstone?

 

I don't respect myself, which makes it much easier.

 

Sure, there are mornings when I wake up and stare at my reflection in the iPad and wonder how I got here, and whether I've hit rock bottom yet.  But then Blizzard tells me I need to win 2 games with my Shaman or Warrior and they'll give me 40 gold - that's four-zero gold pieces people!  So I say screw it and battle my next "worthy opponent."



#46
Tragic

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haah... your cool man.. you'll always have that :)



#47
mnBroncos

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I agree I never could get into hearthstone way to simple to me. I discovered that I am going to ask you to be one of my testers tragic if I ever get one of my three serious card game ideas into a trail condition ha. I like more complex games that is why I have loved getting into CoC. But probably why it isn't as popular to many people want the simplest games *cough magic cough* 



#48
dboeren

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It fills a role.  When I want to play real card games I go down to the LGS and find an opponent.  When I've just got a few minutes to kill I can turn on Hearthstone and play a light game and have a ready opponent anywhere, anytime.



#49
Jhaelen

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how can any self respecting card game player play hearthstone? It is just glorified snap. Has a card play a card. Your entire decision option is just about if you do or do not play it as soon as it comes into your hand. It boggles my mind that this game is so popular!

 

There is Duels of Champions I've tried and while it is not as childish as hearthstone it is not far from it. It at least has some interesting spells and stuff, but it is still just a variant of drop a monster, attack with that monster. Though the positioning data and the spells at least make it a "real" card game over Hearthstone.

Hearthstone manages something that Duel of Champions doesn't, though: It's fun, and it's quick. Also, I think you haven't played it long enough to notice that it's deeper than you give it credit for. The key is to get sufficient draw, otherwise you end up just top-decking.

It's true that the high randomness of many game effects can make or break a game, but that's part of the appeal, since it allows you to 'get lucky' and beat opponents with much better cards. Also, the presentation is flawless and the user interface intuitive. It doesn't have events, but it does have secrets, so there's a way to disrupt your opponent on their turn.

 

And Duel of Champions is definitely deeper than MtG! Now, that may not say much, either, but it's something. It reminds me a bit of AGoT, actually. Instead of the different struggles it has different lines of attack. The event deck fulfills a similar function as the plot deck, and the resource system works - especially since every hero has the abilty to draw an additional card. I don't play it as often as Hearthstone, though, because games can take quite long (~ 30 minutes).

 

Neither is a replacement for playing a round of CoC (or Netrunner or <insert your favorite LCG>) but either can be a good way to while away some time when you can't do that.


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#50
AceRimmer

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They could include the alt art versions of cards that already have alt art. And maybe, just maybe add in a couple others.

I totally agree, but would it take away something from the OP events?



#51
Carthoris

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I totally agree, but would it take away something from the OP events?

 

They'd be made as OP premiums first, and the OP players would get them first. It seems to me that the real draw of OP (like draft) is the play itself, and this sort of feature is gravy, a material takeaway, but not the main product.



#52
Zephyr

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HS is stingy with drops but theyre quite generous with starting neutral pool and giving you 9 factions from the beggining. And some fast grindable cards by leveling up different classes to lv 10, then it gets really slow. But it is still enjoyable game even without good cards. Early boosters do give you a ton of new cards. Just getting those rare ones is a pain. (they dont have that many cards in the whole pool, so maybe thats the main reason for big legendary cards synth prices and probabilities)

Pro tip - when starting play on ranked not casual, casual has terribad balancing (unless they fixed it, its really stupid issue i heard about).

 

If by "campaign" you mean "expert practice" then well, HS had no single, its just for getting used to interface. If you mean Naxxramas on heroic then you should buy some lottery tickets as it sounds straight impossible.

 

Dulel of Champions - played a little bit but wanted to change deck and i couldn't because i had no cards... uninstall DoC. HS is simple, but its fun, well polished and has mechanics suited for digital game where interrupts break the flow too much. And its not that stupid, but nowwhere near CoC or Netrunner level.

 

Back to drafts - too expensive for me, and in LCG model without alt arts or really anything to add any value to cards i'm not a big fan. (I love LCGs for evening floor and not requiering a ton of cash for single cards, but some value would be nice for ppl buying draft packs, and some alt art or sth that thoesnt interferewith LCG premise would be nice) I also in general prefer constructed. But if it brings more players to CoC its nice.

 

PS

HS has nice "a bit draft like" mode - arena. And it's price is reasonable as you're always getting boosters in rewards and daily quests give enough cash for entering arena relatively frequently for in game currency.



#53
Farquhar

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I can say our group is excited and will probably draft once maybe twice, and keep those separate for Draft Deck play.
This way new players and ones with better collection have a more even field of play.

As for a weekly or monthly things I don't think it will happen at our end.

#54
dboeren

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The big problem with all the computer game card games is that there is no way to disrupt your oponant during their turn. No cancels, interrupts, or other surprise actions that change the game state after plans have been formed. It is so static. Mindless even.

 

You know as a test I completed the hearthstone 2nd tier campaign (after the basic ones) for the warrior by just casting what ever card was on the far left of the screen. No thinking, nothing.. Just click on the left of the screen. I lost 2 games! I tried this in 1v1 vs a human and lost 2 and won 4. That game is just stoopid!!

 

Haven't tried Soulforge... I'll give it a go.

 

I agree, not being able to do anything in your opponent's turn puts a significant limit on interaction and reduces the types of abilities the game can have in it.  This is something that is missing from Netrunner too, so it's not just computer games.

 

I think what you're referring to in Hearthstone is the tutorial.  It's supposed to be easy, so I'm not surprised that you found it weak.  Even against a human, if you just started you were playing a rank 25 newbie, someone who just installed the game and is playing their first or second game.  Again, not a challenging opponent.  I think you will find that you can't beat someone at even a moderate rank without having to make more meaningful choices.

 

I think you will find Solforge more appealing.  It's got a substantially bigger pool, it's got "themes" of cards which Hearthstone largely doesn't outside of a small "beast" theme for Hunters, and it has a crapton more abilities including abilities that you can activate.  Hearthstone does not have these, they are all on enters-play, passive, or leaves-play.  In Solforge you can decide when and if to use an ability (still only on your turn though).  You can play cards before or after combat (including both).  There are conditional abilities and bonuses that only work when the situation is right.  There are cards that interact with the discard pile.  And because cards level up when you use them, you have to balance now vs. future.  This card is better in my immediate situation, but this other card will be better if I can level it up.  Can I afford to take a weaker card now in return for a better long-term investment?  Will the game last long enough for that investment to pay off?

 

Like all CCGs though, you won't initially have the card pool to see everything it can do and many themes will want some Heroic level cards to work well.  A few deck themes that I enjoy are:
Yetis:  Relatively pillow-fisted with good health, but they can buff each other and tend to have good abilities

Forge Guardians:  Robots that sort of suck on their own, but if you can keep enough of them alive they can combine into Voltron and get really powerful

Poison:  Deck based around damage-over-time effects and strong actions that can only target creatures with poison on them

Plants:  Lots of free 1/1 seedlings, actions that can grow any plant into a fairly stout tree-man, etc...



#55
IoriYagami

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I guess draft is mostly for new players who want a couple of games to find out whether they'll like it. Or just play it for some time without getting into collecting all you can get to build every deck imaginable. Not a bad format if you can afford it regularly and it's peanuts to you - why not? So those new players could have some chance to play on even grounds with others (well, just cardpoolwise, not considering skill and experience of  older players :rolleyes: ). As for me, nope. I'd only want the exclusive cards, don't care about alt arts, and probably won't find newbies wanting to spend money on a unfamiliar game - it's either veterans who have what they need or newcomer whom you provide with your own preconstructed deck for the time of the match.