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Scum Spoiler from Wreched Hive by The Combat Guild.

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124 replies to this topic

#81
TheNameWasTaken

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Looks valid to me. Probably needs to be dealt with similar to the Well Paid/RSX/ Hobbie/Hero's trial infinite loop I win combo....

 

Except tougher to deal with, because there all you needed was an unit with 3 guns or a Force Lightning (and probably other tools existed as well). Only event cancel can save you here, and there's very little of that around.

 

 A fix seems simple, though. Unrefusable Offer should only bump the dial if there was no engagement declared and the objective was still in play. Off the top of my head, it doesn't seem like such a change would be much of a nerf outside of this one combo.


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#82
colsanders

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Edit *nevermind Brainfart

Seems highly unlikely to do so I'm not worried about the combo
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#83
doctormungmung

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Edit *nevermind Brainfart

Seems highly unlikely to do so I'm not worried about the combo


So was the RSX combo. Even if a rare occurrence, If it's a total NPE should be dealt with. At least in my opinion.

Perhaps of yodaman would be so kind to run the numbers for this and the RSX combo we can get a better feel for the frequency of seeing the combos.

#84
Boreas

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There is a 13,(3)% chance of having 2x same objective on the first turn.

Then you have ~10% chance of having 2x Unrefusable Offer/ 1x Unrefusable Offer and 1x Chain Reaction, but you need one more event.

 

 

But you can execute this combo later. Masterful Manipulation helps finding objectives. I think about 20% of having 2x IDLYE second turn.

 

Of course dial +6 is also very good. 



#85
pantsyg

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So was the RSX combo. Even if a rare occurrence, If it's a total NPE should be dealt with. At least in my opinion.

Perhaps of yodaman would be so kind to run the numbers for this and the RSX combo we can get a better feel for the frequency of seeing the combos.

 

Off the back of the cuff, this combo is less likely than the Hobbie RSX. 

 

Hobbie combo:

 

Hero's Trial out

RSX in play 

Hobbie

Well Paid

 

This combo (at minimum) 

 

2 IDLYE out 

Unrefeusable Offer x2 or Unrefuseable + Chain Reaction

 

While the Hobbie combo requires more moving parts, needing both IDLYE makes that combo harder--you can't cycle your objective deck to dig for combo pieces. Also, there are 4 RSXs in Hobbie's set and they're your best unit, so you're mulliganing for them, they're more likely to be found than 2 specific events, and as long as they stick on the table you're only looking for Hobbie + Well Paid. Well Paid is also 4x. 



#86
Boreas

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I think dial +6 is enough to win most games and you do not have to build your deck around useless objectives.


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#87
chiller087

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Lemme get this straight:

In this example, there is only one copy of IDLYE, with 5 health, on the table:

1. Play UO on LS turn.
2a. LS can interrupt UO.
2b. DS can interrupt UO. (From here on, we'll assume no interrupts for anything.)
3. UO resolves, Effect targets IDLYE.
4a. LS can react to UO.
4b. DS can react to UO, uses IDLYE, dealing two damage to IDLYE. Effect targets IDLYE.
5. IDLYE (first time) resolves.
6a. LS can react to IDLYE (first time)
6b. DS can react to IDLYE (first time), plays Chan Reaction.
7. Chain Reaction resolves. Effect targets IDLYE.
8a. LS can react to Chain Reaction.
8b. DS can react to Chain Reaction, uses IDLYE (2nd time), dealing another two damage.
9. IDLYE (second time) resolves. Effect targets IDLYE.
10a. LS can react to IDLYE (second time).
10b. DS can react to IDLYE (second time).
11a. LS can react to Chain Reaction.
11b. DS can react to Chain Reaction.
12a. LS can react to IDLYE (first time).
12b. DS can react to IDLYE (first time).
13a. LS can react to UO.
13b. DS can react to UO.

At this point, no more reactions can be played to any of the above effects.

14. LS can play an action, passes.
15. DS plays any event, tries to copy it with IDLYE, attempting to pay the cost of dealing 2 damage.

Since it's down to one health, only 1 damage can be dealt. The cost is therefore not considered to be paid, and nothing is copied. However, it is destroyed nonetheless. UO was used once and copied an additional THREE times, for a total of +8 dial clicks, and IDLYE was the target objective each time. It is no longer in play, and therefore cannot be engaged. Automatic +EIGHT dial clicks.

Do I have that correct?

#88
Rio

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Didnt I mention this like last week?

#89
Rio

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Mine was having the Sarlaac on the objective to get the extra damage needed to blow the objective up.

#90
chiller087

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Didnt I mention this like last week?


Since this is pretty technical, I just want to be doubly sure I understand not only the end result, but every single step from start to finish; mostly so I can have a good grasp of what card effects could stop this in case I need to judge this in a tournament.

#91
chiller087

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Anyway, if this becomes real NPE, in six months FFG will issue errata to UO to add a line that says "and the objective is still in play" to kill this nonsense.

#92
Rio

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Chain Reaction and this pod should probably be on the restricted list or IDLYE should be limit ONE per turn.

#93
normanh

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Well at least we don't have to worry about an IDLYE+CR+Superlaser Blast+Mission combo.



#94
Boreas

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Mine was having the Sarlaac on the objective to get the extra damage needed to blow the objective up.

 

Yeah, but with an additional event it is easier to trgiger.



#95
Jarratt

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Chain Reaction and this pod should probably be on the restricted list or IDLYE should be limit ONE per turn.

Yes to limits. I don't understand why they keep failing to put them on cards that should have them. Costs like damage or destroy objective still need limits.

They made a massive mistake in X-Wing by assuming the cost of stress or ion was enough of a disincentive to use an effect and therefore the cost of the crew that has the "penalty" to trigger was reduced to a really low value.

And what happened. Clever players found ways to abuse the heck out of it.
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#96
Letux

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Well at least we don't have to worry about an IDLYE+CR+Superlaser Blast+Mission combo.


Play some 2v2!
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#97
RoyalAegis

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On an unrelated note since this seems to be the current scum thread:

 

Do BtS Boba and either of the IG-88s get play anymore? I don't see them mentioned too much. If not, does anyone anticipate their return when Scrap Metal gets released for a Bounty Hunter centered deck?



#98
Rio

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On an unrelated note since this seems to be the current scum thread:
 
Do BtS Boba and either of the IG-88s get play anymore? I don't see them mentioned too much. If not, does anyone anticipate their return when Scrap Metal gets released for a Bounty Hunter centered deck?


I like both sets. I still sometimes run BtS Fett in decks usually as a 1 off. I like the unit a lot and the set has a resource. IG 88B is a top Scum set I would rate it higher than Bane Maler but below Dengar. IG 88 is kinda meh, if I run him it's a 1 off too.

#99
Rio

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Yes to limits. I don't understand why they keep failing to put them on cards that should have them. Costs like damage or destroy objective still need limits.
They made a massive mistake in X-Wing by assuming the cost of stress or ion was enough of a disincentive to use an effect and therefore the cost of the crew that has the "penalty" to trigger was reduced to a really low value.
And what happened. Clever players found ways to abuse the heck out of it.


I think this set should be limit one per deck, and IDLYE should be limit One per turn, the pod is straight nuts.. The ability to trigger cards like Captured 2 times in a round for 3 cost is broken. If Jabba wasn't spoiled, I might not be saying this.Spice Blitz as well, and these are just scum cards

#100
Jarratt

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I like both sets. I still sometimes run BtS Fett in decks usually as a 1 off. I like the unit a lot and the set has a resource. IG 88B is a top Scum set I would rate it higher than Bane Maler but below Dengar. IG 88 is kinda meh, if I run him it's a 1 off too.


I like Iggy Prime better than Iggy B. Iggy B has some nice tricks but is super aggressive and very droid orientated. Iggy Prime has no resource which used to matter and doesn't anymore. Those chuds are great and Iggy Prime has stupid stats even for a 5 cost character. I don't think I would run him as a 2x, but he goes well with Bane and is a pretty great defender.