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New Player Questions, Round 2

- - - - - Rules Questions

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#1
Darksbane

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This is a continuation of the original New Player Questions thread found here:

http://www.cardgamed...ayer-questions/

The old thread was starting to get quite large and sometimes that can cause issues. So I've locked it and started this one to continue the discussion.

#2
Staton

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So if the passives go off one at a time is there a response window to each passive effect? Or will do all passive effects resolve before the responses? The exact situation in this case is with Meera Reed. Will I have two different response windows to attempt to trigger her response? (In case the first response is canceled, etc.) .


All passives are resolved before any responses. However, you will still be able to trigger responses to each instance of the passive effect. So if two refugees get discarded, you can trigger meera on the first one, she gets canceled, trigger her again on the second one.

#3
slothgodfather

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But that does mean you have to fully resolve both of your refugees before reaching the response window which would allow you to put Meera back into shadows provided you didn't pay to keep at least 1 of your refugees. So if you suspect she is going to get cancelled, you would potentially have to let them both go in order to get the potential of a second attempt on her.

#4
agktmte

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Excellent. Which is what I did. Though I did trigger her response before deciding whether or not to pay for the second one. It was canceled so I didn't pay for the second one either and triggered it again. So I guess the fully correct way would be to choose to discard both, and then I would have two chances to respond with Meera, but if the first one wasn't canceled, then I lost both refugees for no reason. Correct?

#5
slothgodfather

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That's the way it looks to me.

#6
whitewalker82

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well might as well add some more questions to the new topic:
1) Ser Preston Greenfield (TTotH) How can you win a challenge as a defender? I thought you can only successfully defend a challenge not win a challenge?
2) Rhoynar Emissary (AHM) can I pick a character and declare stealth on it with another one of my characters to apply this effect?

#7
slothgodfather

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1. When you successfully defend a challenge, you are the winner. This allows you to trigger "after you win a challenge" and "after you successfully defend" abilities as well as "after you win a challenge of type X" effects.

2. Nope. Because stealth makes them ineligible for that challenge. The emissary is more looked at forcing your opponent to over commit or to block a deadly attack by threat of the discard effect.
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#8
Anarchosyn

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Quick question:

So, if I have multiple responses that can trigger off a framework event, I am indeed given the option to trigger them all, correct?

For example, if I'm playing a sand snake Martell deck:

1. The Red Viper (PotS) is paid as claim.
2. During the response window (stage 5 of the framework event) I can play No Use For Grief (DB)...
3. which then allows me to dig out Dorea Sand (TftH) (along with all her sisters), triggering her response effect along the way...
4. and then play A Nest of Vipers (TftH) (collecting, in a best case scenario solely from renown, 18 power in one phase).

I can do all off that as a response to the claim event?

In addition to this mega combo, is there any way to confer the Sand Snake trait to Arianne Martell (PotS)? I've seen an effect or two for naming and giving traits to characters in play, but can't recall the house affiliations or specifics of these cards (I want to say it's a location, but I might be hallucinating that).

*edit: Follow-up question, if I have any sand snake cards in my hand, I wouldn't be able to put them in play for free using No Use for Grief triggered off the Red Viper, no? It doesn't specifically say what is searched during the Red Viper line, though it does specify the deck in a prior conditional).

*Edit #2:

Card question

Maiden of Poisons (ODG)

So, if I had three of these in play, I could trigger the response three times (and, in fact, could even trigger this response when bringing them into play with the aforementioned No Use For Grief). Since turns can bog down and take some time in 4~5 player games, and this effect is global (yet each player gets to apply the effect to an individual character), how would you suggest tracking this information during play? Granted, it only needs to be tracked till every player gets to play through their Challenges, but I can imagine this kind of fiddly behavior could be forgotten.

#9
Grimwalker

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Quick question:

So, if I have multiple responses that can trigger off a framework event, I am indeed given the option to trigger them all, correct?

For example, if I'm playing a sand snake Martell deck:

1. The Red Viper (PotS) is paid as claim.
2. During the response window (stage 5 of the framework event) I can play No Use For Grief (DB)...
3. which then allows me to dig out Dorea Sand (TftH) (along with all her sisters), triggering her response effect along the way...
4. and then play A Nest of Vipers (TftH) (collecting, in a best case scenario solely from renown, 18 power in one phase).

I can do all off that as a response to the claim event?

In addition to this mega combo, is there any way to confer the Sand Snake trait to Arianne Martell (PotS)? I've seen an effect or two for naming and giving traits to characters in play, but can't recall the house affiliations or specifics of these cards (I want to say it's a location, but I might be hallucinating that).

*edit: Follow-up question, if I have any sand snake cards in my hand, I wouldn't be able to put them in play for free using No Use for Grief triggered off the Red Viper, no? It doesn't specifically say what is searched during the Red Viper line, though it does specify the deck in a prior conditional).


Yes, you can trigger No Use For Grief, play half your deck, then trigger Dorea Sand. It's brutal if you can get it to go off perfectly. But it is balanced by, yes, you can't play what's in your hand, nor what's already in your Dead pile, and other people get responses during the window too, so you're risking cancel effects at key points, and I hope you can close escrow before you get Valar'd into the pavement.


Card question

Maiden of Poisons (ODG)

So, if I had three of these in play, I could trigger the response three times (and, in fact, could even trigger this response when bringing them into play with the aforementioned No Use For Grief). Since turns can bog down and take some time in 4~5 player games, and this effect is global (yet each player gets to apply the effect to an individual character), how would you suggest tracking this information during play? Granted, it only needs to be tracked till every player gets to play through their Challenges, but I can imagine this kind of fiddly behavior could be forgotten.


I suppose you could put a gold token from the treasury on each chosen character, if the board was busy enough to warrant it.
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#10
Angarde

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It might be obvious but I have a problem with "Opposes" such as:
1) In what circumstances does it work? I mean should I:
- win the Power challenge or any other?
- be attacker or defender (or both?)
2) If someone help me as a "supporting player" and I lost a challege with my "opposing opponent" can he claim power for opposes?

I just need clarification a bit :)
Thanx in advance for help

#11
Staton

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Opposing works on both offense and defense. Its on any challenge, but can only be triggered once. So if you oppose someone, and win three challenges against them, you still only claim one power. If someone opposes you, attacks you, someone who supports you defends for you, and the attacker still wins, he still won a challenge against you, so you still have to fulfill the claim and he still gets a power.

#12
agktmte

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Question: If I trigger Meera Reed (TftH)'s any phase ability and then choose a noble crest character, Eddard Stark (TTotH) can cancel the effect, but just the then part of Meera's effect? Or does it cancel the whole effect (putting her back into shadows at the expense of my one gold)?

Obviously this is not possible if it is winter and Meera's effect chooses two targets.

#13
Staton

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I don't believe you'd be able to cancel it at all. If you cancel it, then she was never brought into play and therefore, never got to the "then" part of her ability so Eddard never would've been chosen anyway. I could be wrong, but I don't think Eddard could cancel the ability at all.

#14
slothgodfather

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The triggered effect of Meera is to come out of shadows. Once that resolves sucessfully there is not an opportunity to cancel the "then" portion of the text. When she comes out of shadows and into play resolves successfully, the "then" portion happens. However, the "then" portion is definately not considered a different part of this trigger in terms of cancelling (yes it is now considered a character ability because she is in play - but it is not a new triggered effect). Since Eddard can't cancel her coming out of shadows, he can't be used to cancel her blanking effect.
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#15
Anarchosyn

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Card questions:

1. Crown of Winter (LoW)

Is this Winter without the income choking effects of the White Raven (TWoW)?

2. Am I right in thinking I can only have either the attachment Grey Wind (LoW) or the character Grey Wind (Core) in play at any one time? Also, I can only have three of these in my deck across all the cards, correct? e.g. 2 character Grey Winds and 1 attachment version, but if the character version hits the dead pile then I can never put the attachment in play, right?

3. Frozen Outpost (LoW): Is the target of this card still considered a participant in the challenge? If so, then is this different than what occurs with Jhogo's Whip (OSaS) (a card I always understood as a means to remove the opposition during a challenge)? If not, then what benefit is the added strength?

*edit: I couldn't look at the cards while posting. Is it the "stand and remove" line in Jhogo's Whip's text that creates the removal effect (i.e. that I should never assume "stand" means "to remove" unless the card specifically says so)?

#16
emptyrepublic

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1. Crown of Winter (LoW)

Is this Winter without the income choking effects of the White Raven (TWoW)?


Correct and note that it doesn't make it the exclusive season. If the Crown of Meereen (QoD) is out as well it would be Winter AND Summer.

2. Am I right in thinking I can only have either the attachment Grey Wind (LoW) or the character Grey Wind (Core) in play at any one time? Also, I can only have three of these in my deck across all the cards, correct? e.g. 2 character Grey Winds and 1 attachment version, but if the character version hits the dead pile then I can never put the attachment in play, right?


Correct. You can have three of the same "title" card in a deck regardless of version or type. If Grey Wind the character is in the graveyard you cannot play the attachment (unless you get the card out of the graveyard).

3. Frozen Outpost (LoW): Is the target of this card still considered a participant in the challenge? If so, then is this different than what occurs with Jhogo's Whip (OSaS) (a card I always understood as a means to remove the opposition during a challenge)? If not, then what benefit is the added strength?

*edit: I couldn't look at the cards while posting. Is it the "stand and remove" line in Jhogo's Whip's text that creates the removal effect (i.e. that I should never assume "stand" means "to remove" unless the card specifically says so)?


Unless the card says the character is removed from the challenge if a character has been declared to participate they can be standing on their head by the end of the challenge and their strength would still count. Frozen output is useful because it allows you to declare a defender, boost them for the challenge and still have them available to participate in another challenge.
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#17
MrCarbohydrate

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I hope you can close escrow before you get Valar'd into the pavement.

I didn't think this would be a problem with that scenario, since I thought it was determined that No Use For Grief can also pull duplicates for the unique sand snakes.

#18
matthew

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Q. Bear Island (AE). Can you have a card in shadow and still trigger Bear Island? or will this count as a card you control that has no stark affiliation? Also, I presume cards like The Hound (PotS) with double affiliation are ok, right?

#19
slothgodfather

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I honestly don't know the answer shadows cards, but my guess would be as long as you can prove that they are all of the Stark affiliation then you are OK. Also, multiple affiliation cards should be fine provided it still satisfies the requirement "has the Stark affiliation."

#20
agktmte

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I believe in the rules for Shadows cards it talks about the shadows area being out of play (or separate from "in play" anyway). So you don't actually control them in play. So I would imagine that it has no impact on the Bear Island condition.
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