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Opening night


12 replies to this topic

#1
delpiero7086

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If I succeed at opening night, can I simply just ready an exhausted character I control or it has to be an insane character that should be restored first and then readied
Another debate is whether the player has to pay for the character's printed cost to put it in play when ambush been played
Any enlightenment would be highly appreciated,thanks very much

#2
delpiero7086

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Opening night and ambush

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#3
RichardPlunkett

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Opening night doesn't specific an insane character and in general effects don't need to work completely in order to be applied - you just do the bits you can. Given those it seems certain that you could use Opening Night's effect on a non-insane character to get just the readying effect.

 

As for ambush, I have always assumed and seen others assume that you did not have to pay for the cost, that the Ambush was doing the playing, not just allowing an out-of-sequence play and while on consideration this isn't as clear as I would like, I think the later would have be worded differently.

It's still usually a pretty terrible card.



#4
delpiero7086

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Opening night doesn't specific an insane character and in general effects don't need to work completely in order to be applied - you just do the bits you can. Given those it seems certain that you could use Opening Night's effect on a non-insane character to get just the readying effect.
 
As for ambush, I have always assumed and seen others assume that you did not have to pay for the cost, that the Ambush was doing the playing, not just allowing an out-of-sequence play and while on consideration this isn't as clear as I would like, I think the later would have be worded differently.
It's still usually a pretty terrible card.


Thanks a lot RP

#5
Sadric

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As for ambush, I have always assumed and seen others assume that you did not have to pay for the cost, that the Ambush was doing the playing, not just allowing an out-of-sequence play and while on consideration this isn't as clear as I would like, I think the later would have be worded differently.

It's still usually a pretty terrible card.

 

Hi, for Ambush we always think you have to pay the cost of the card because it says "play a character card...". If it was "put in play a character card..." it would be for free.

in the faq I found only this:

 

To “play” a card is to pay all costs and follow all play restrictions in order to bring the card into play from a player’s hand. Card effects that take place when a card is played do not work if the card entered play through any alternate way

 

I'm a little confused, what do you think about it?

I think "play" means paying cost  :unsure:


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#6
RichardPlunkett

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You make a convincing argument. I was thinking on text such as Corrupted Midwife:: Action: Exhaust Corrupted Midwife to choose 1 character in your discard pile. Play that character as if it were in your hand as your next action. 

There you are clearly expected to pay for playing the card.

I wonder if my group used a favorable interpretation without thought to offset the card's general crappiness (its a bad card if free and a truly terrible card if you have to pay). That sounds like a very plausible thing to have happen.

Apart from that, the fact it cost-limits the card to its own cost is suggestive to me that the cost of the play has been 'folded in'.

 

But, I think having to pay the cost extra is probably the most rules-consistent interpretation. Sigh.



#7
Tragic

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Put Into Play  == Free.. just place it on the table

Play == Play it exactly as if you played it normally in the operations phase. Tapping domains, sac'n cards... whatever the card requires as its normal cost.


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#8
periodico

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Put Into Play  == Free.. just place it on the table
Play == Play it exactly as if you played it normally in the operations phase. Tapping domains, sac'n cards... whatever the card requires as its normal cost.


If the PLAY means the action PLAY, it will cause a problem about timing. The action window of Ambush has not closen while you are required to do a new one. So I incline to the opinion that the text is wrong. It means PUT INTO PLAY considering the early card.

#9
Tragic

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I wonder if my group used a favorable interpretation without thought to offset the card's general crappiness (its a bad card if free and a truly terrible card if you have to pay). That sounds like a very plausible thing to have happen.

 

The power of this card is that it runs at Action Speed and has a zero cost.

 

post-21441-0-89998700-1500172050.jpg

 

This makes it a great blocker, as it can allow you to play at action speed units to send into the stories AFTER the active player has already committed his own cards. This can easily win you stories, or kill top cards.

 

It should be noted that it also says COST.. not PRINTED COST. So cost reduction apply on the card you are putting out, allowing you to put out some strong stuff if you are in shubby.

 

In addition, there are ways you can "save" your card. Basically you can bounce it back into hand or top of deck or w/e... though this may be cost intensive. 

 

The best way to use this, is for it to have some kind of cost reduction and also some kind of enter play ability.

 

Like ferocious dark one for example.. With this card you can chain 3 TS2 cards onto the table at action speed... pretty cool!

 

UQRXGD.jpg

 

but there is a ton of other stuff.... it says on the table, assuming it is not destroyed, until the end of the phase, you will get "on commit" effects... anda host of other triggers before it goes away.

 

like how about destroying an entire board, including Ancient Ones?

 

UsCu3I.jpg

 

Also, remember you are forced to sac it right (being insane will not protect it form that btw) but as it is getting sacs.. you can sac it yourself for effect.... 



#10
Tragic

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If the PLAY means the action PLAY, it will cause a problem about timing. The action window of Ambush has not closen while you are required to do a new one. So I incline to the opinion that the text is wrong. It means PUT INTO PLAY considering the early card.

 

Well. considering there was a ton of FAQs and errata and this was never addressed even once.. i would say that it is 100% working as intended.... as you need to PAY the cost... just like you do on EVERY card that says "play" and not "put into play".

 

not sure what you mean by the timing error, as it doesn't seem to have one?



#11
RichardPlunkett

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Hi Tragic! I guess we will have to agree to disgree about its value as a card.

And I think the lack of FAQ entries isn't always sign of general agreement since rules confusion and lack of errata/FAQ are very common for cards that don't get played a lot. It's at least possible Ambush is in that basket.

 

But I think we agree on all the rules stuff at this point.

 

Play == Pay and as for the timing strangeness, cards are allowed to overide the default rules and this card is allowing you to do that by doing a "play" as part of the resoultion of it's effect, thus presumably at any time this action was legal.

 

PS periodico, feel free to talk your local cohort into whatever errata takes your fancy. I know my cohort doesn't always do things by-the-book (we are even worse when playing lotr).



#12
Tragic

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well it depends on your deck, no one is saying it is not weaker than others.. but the torny scene is gone and now decks can just be fun.

 

Ambush works well in a few decks.. for example a ritual one... so mix Shubby with Silver and sac dark ones to fuels the alters and use the recursion to put them all back on the table... also works with snakes. 

 

Should be noted that common shut down card for dogs and myths, prepared alienist only stops "put into play" effects and not play effects. Flux Stabiliser still dose, but the point is that Alienist is more common.



#13
periodico

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well it depends on your deck, no one is saying it is not weaker than others.. but the torny scene is gone and now decks can just be fun.

 

Ambush works well in a few decks.. for example a ritual one... so mix Shubby with Silver and sac dark ones to fuels the alters and use the recursion to put them all back on the table... also works with snakes. 

 

Should be noted that common shut down card for dogs and myths, prepared alienist only stops "put into play" effects and not play effects. Flux Stabiliser still dose, but the point is that Alienist is more common.

 

I find that you are right. Tommy Malloy, Syndicate jumper, has a similar effect. I told a wrong explanation to my cohort while at issue  :( .





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