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[Ruling] High Sparrow

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Best Answer colonialbob , 17 January 2018 - 01:43 AM

1. The opponent will collect 7 gold for income.

 
2. Yes. They will gain 1 gold.
 
3. Yes. Each player will draw 1 card (assuming neither has drawn cards other than the 2 for the draw phase).
 
4. Each player will draw 1 card during the draw phase.
 
5. The opponent can choose the draw 2 option. If you have drawn 2 cards already this turn, you will only draw 1 card due to Words are Wind. If you have already drawn 3 cards this turn, you will draw no cards due to Words are Wind.

 

 
Danny Schaefer, 16.1.2018
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#1
colonialbob

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Danny,

 
I wanted to ask a few questions about High Sparrow to make sure I understand how all the interactions work. For all of these questions, we'll assume I have a High Sparrow in play. I'm choosing to ask with scenarios, because I think that's the easiest way to illustrate the questions I have.
 
1) The opponent reveals Trading with the Pentoshi. How many gold does the opponent collect for income?
 
2) The opponent reveals Time of Plenty. The opponent gains 6 gold for income, and also has a Northern Encampment in play and standing. Can they trigger it? If so, how much gold do they gain?
 
3) I have a Dragon's Tail. Can I play it after the draw phase? If so, how many cards will each player draw?
 
4) I play Dragon's Tail during the plot phase. How many cards will each player draw during the draw phase?
 
5) I play Words are Wind as an interrupt to an opponent's event in the Challenges Phase. Can they choose to have me draw 2 cards instead of canceling their event? If so, how many cards do I draw? Does this answer change if I have already drawn 3 cards (for example, I revealed Counting Coppers)?


#2
colonialbob

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✓  Best Answer

1. The opponent will collect 7 gold for income.

 
2. Yes. They will gain 1 gold.
 
3. Yes. Each player will draw 1 card (assuming neither has drawn cards other than the 2 for the draw phase).
 
4. Each player will draw 1 card during the draw phase.
 
5. The opponent can choose the draw 2 option. If you have drawn 2 cards already this turn, you will only draw 1 card due to Words are Wind. If you have already drawn 3 cards this turn, you will draw no cards due to Words are Wind.

 

 
Danny Schaefer, 16.1.2018

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#3
ystros

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How does High Sparrow interact with collecting income in the marshal phase?

 

Let's say you've gained the maximum 7 gold during the plot phase through plots (e.g. you reveal Trade Routes, opponent reveals Pentoshi, etc). Marshal phase begins, you're not allowed to gain anymore gold.

 

Would you simply not collect income that round, or would you "collect income" of 0 gold and thus allow abilities to trigger off of collecting income (e.g. an opponent triggers A Meager Contribution or White Tree to steal 1 of your gold already gained, or you being able to double the Iron Bank's gold)?


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#4
mplain

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I play Words are Wind as an interrupt to an opponent's event in the Challenges Phase. Can they choose to have me draw 2 cards instead of canceling their event? If so, how many cards do I draw? Does this answer change if I have already drawn 3 cards (for example, I revealed Counting Coppers)?


The opponent can choose the draw 2 option. If you have drawn 2 cards already this turn, you will only draw 1 card due to Words are Wind. If you have already drawn 3 cards this turn, you will draw no cards due to Words are Wind.


This is reeeally weird. He says you can choose an option that you cannot resolve.


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#5
colonialbob

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How does High Sparrow interact with collecting income in the marshal phase?

 

Let's say you've gained the maximum 7 gold during the plot phase through plots (e.g. you reveal Trade Routes, opponent reveals Pentoshi, etc). Marshal phase begins, you're not allowed to gain anymore gold.

 

Would you simply not collect income that round, or would you "collect income" of 0 gold and thus allow abilities to trigger off of collecting income (e.g. an opponent triggers A Meager Contribution or White Tree to steal 1 of your gold already gained, or you being able to double the Iron Bank's gold)?

 

The Trading ruling seems to indicate you can collect income even when you can't collect the full amount. As such I think collecting an income of zero is a perfectly valid option (you could do it other ways as well, such as playing Valar with two Pleasure Barges and no gold modifiers).



#6
Sulpures

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This is reeeally weird. He says you can choose an option that you cannot resolve.

 

Can't find any ruling support to this answer. Hope Danny could confirm this once again.



#7
mplain

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Can't find any ruling support to this answer. Hope Danny could confirm this once again.

 
Apparently there is a difference between "cannot be canceled" and "cannot draw cards".

 

"Cannot be canceled" is a variant of the general "Cannot be {Variable}ed" rule that specifically says "that card cannot be chosen to be {variable}ed by a card ability or game effect that would {variable} the card". So a player cannot choose for Words Are Wind to cancel The Bounty of Highgarden.

 

"Cannot draw cards" is only bound by the general "Cannot" rule which does not mention any restrictions to choices being made. So it only prevents the effect from resolving (the player from drawing cards), but doesn't prevent the opponent from choosing an option that cannot resolve.



#8
Sulpures

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Apparently there is a difference between "cannot be canceled" and "cannot draw cards".
 
"Cannot be canceled" is a variant of the general "Cannot be {Variable}ed" rule that specifically says "that card cannot be chosen to be {variable}ed by a card ability or game effect that would {variable} the card". So a player cannot choose for Words Are Wind to cancel The Bounty of Highgarden.
 
"Cannot draw cards" is only bound by the general "Cannot" rule which does not mention any restrictions to choices being made. So it only prevents the effect from resolving (the player from drawing cards), but doesn't prevent the opponent from choosing an option that cannot resolve.


But if you choose draw option, you change no game state, isn't that against the rule?

#9
mplain

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But if you choose draw option, you change no game state, isn't that against the rule?

 
RRG "Abilities" says that "a card ability can only be initiated if its effect has the potential to change the game state."

 

Words Are Wind can be initiated even if High Septon prevents drawing cards, because its effects have potential to change the game state - the opponent could choose the "cancel the event's effects" option.

There are no rules that would prevent a player from choosing a no-change-of-game-state option while an ability is already resolving (in L5R there is such a rule, but in AGOT there isn't).

 

Now, if a player cannot draw cards due to High Sparrow, AND the event's effects cannot be canceled, then Words Are Wind cannot be played.



#10
colonialbob

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Follow-up questions postes by request:

Answer 5 leads me to a couple of further questions for clarification:

1. If both my opponent and I have already drawn 3 cards this round (with a High Sparrow in play), can I play Dragon Tail?

2. If an opponent plays Bounty of Highgarden and I play Words are Wind, can they choose the 'cancel those effects' option even though Bounty cannot be cancelled?

#11
colonialbob

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1. No. An ability can only be initiated if it has the potential to change the game state. Because neither player can draw cards, Dragon’s Tail will be unable to change the game state and therefore cannot be played.

2. No. This is covered by the FAQ under 2.1 Cannot be {Variable}ed: "If a card "cannot be {variable}ed," where {variable} is something that would happen to the card such as "killed," "discarded," or "knelt," that card cannot be chosen to be {variable}ed by a card ability or game effect that would {variable} the card.” In this case, because Bounty of Highgarden cannot be canceled, the opponent cannot choose for it to be canceled by Words are Wind’s ability and must instead choose the “draw 2 cards” option.


[Danny Schaefer, 30.1.2018]