599 replies to this topic

[concerned]

I understand this is a big accusation. Please trust that myself and a friend have gone through the videos of the Gencon final and semifinal games over and over to make sure we are absolutely certain. 

 

Unfortunately there is no question. In the final match of the of the Conquest US Nationals game posted on Team Covenants YouTube channel, you can repeatedly see the winning Eldorath player draw three cards in the HQ phase instead of two.

 

To observe this, I recommend watching the videos below on both fullscreen and 1080p. If you freeze-frame watch (you have to be as quick as you can, stop every fraction of a second, he's very fast and subtle..) the Eldorath players draw in rounds 1, 2, and 3 during the HQ phase at 3:39-3:41, 9:06-9:09, 12:14-12:17 respectively in the Final match, and rounds 1 of the semi-final game at  5:31-5:34, you can clearly see that the player is drawing three cards instead of two. 

 

 

Finals game:

 

Semi-final game:

 

 

Please know that I'm not here to ruin anyone's day, or anyone's experience with Conquest. That being said, given the level of this tournament, I feel its something the community should know about. 

 

 

A concerned player

[Cimadon]

WTF. It sure looks like the Eldorath player is drawing 3 cards in multiple HQ phases. If that's the case, what should the repercutions be? 

 

EDIT: At 3:39 it is so clear he draws 3 cards. I even counted the cards before and after, 6 cards before he drew, 9 cards after. What a cheater!

[someguy11]

This is disappointing. I am not sure if FFG has anything in place to retroactively strip someone of their title, but if this was magic, Wizards would do so.

[LordVampire]

Wow, that is clearly visible if you know what to look for.

Eternal shame be with thee!

[Cimadon]

This is disappointing. I am not sure if FFG has anything in place to retroactively strip someone of their title, but if this was magic, Wizards would do so.

He should absolutely be stripped of his title! And shouldn't be allowed to play competitive Conquest anymore.

[LilBabyDragon]

For those who don't know, you can slow down (and speed up, for that matter) Youtube vids by clicking on the gear icon. If you set it to 0.5 speed, it makes it a lot easier to see what happens and freeze frame when appropriate.

[Koz]

I haven't watched the video yet (I can't at work), but I wonder how much stuff like this goes on in general.  I mean, you can only watch your opponent so closely and still focus on your own game.  Plus I generally trust people unless I'm given a reason not to.

 

Based on the comments here it seems the evidence is pretty damning.  That's a real shame and a blight on the event as a whole.

[AriceJ]

In all honesty, imo, this isn't something that is uncommon. 

 

I say this because my gaming friends and I have come across similar behavior in various tournament settings, not just with FFG games. Again, I am merely trying to posit the thought that this sort of behavior (downright cheating) does happen more than we know.... it is just that in this instance, we have it on film. 

 

[Majestaat]

It's strange though, with the top matches having referees on them and many spectators, without anyone noticing anything.

I doubt FFG will do anything retroactive, but I sure hope a big sanction for the future. Heck, even a permanent ban from official FFG tournaments seems appropiate.

 

 

In all honesty, imo, this isn't something that is uncommon. 

 

I say this because my gaming friends and I have come across similar behavior in various tournament settings, not just with FFG games. Again, I am merely trying to posit the thought that this sort of behavior (downright cheating) does happen more than we know.... it is just that in this instance, we have it on film. 

 

Sadly, that just speaks poorly of the players who do so and those who allow it. If someone does something bad and gets away with it, it shouldn't mean other people imitate that behavior. Otherwise, we would all be murderers by now D:

[SyntaxLost]

This looks incredibly deliberate and very well executed to avoid detection. Notice the difference in how he draws cards during command vs HQ. During HQ, he always brings the cards to the back of his hand and holds them in one stack such that it's nearly impossible to see the move without the camera replay.

 

It's likely that he was doing this the whole tournament. I guess he got a little cocky thinking that it wouldn't be detected by the camera. It almost wasn't.

[Cimadon]

In all honesty, imo, this isn't something that is uncommon. 
 
I say this because my gaming friends and I have come across similar behavior in various tournament settings, not just with FFG games. Again, I am merely trying to posit the thought that this sort of behavior (downright cheating) does happen more than we know.... it is just that in this instance, we have it on film. 
 

That doesn't make it ok. There is no excuse for blatantly cheating.

[AriceJ]

It's likely that he was doing this the whole tournament. I guess he got a little cocky thinking that it wouldn't be detected by the camera. It almost wasn't.

 

That's it.

 

Furthermore, if he was challenged by a single opponent, in earlier matches, I bet that this idiot would've thought twice before he carried on in this manner. And then, he more than likely would have continued doing so, again. 

[kwarrend]

Guys, should we be concerned that elements of Chaos are now ACTUALLY seeping into players of the game?

 

But seriously, I haven't seen the video yet but will go grab a pitchfork if need-be.

[SyntaxLost]

This method is very strong given how it evaded detection for so long, even with footage being online for almost a month. If you were sitting across from him, you'd have to carefully count cards for it to be apparent. No Conquest player does this.

 

But I guess we can learn from this: if you ever see player drawing cards in clusters, then start paying very close attention to the numbers.

[BuzzsawMF]

This makes me sad on several levels.

[MessorMortis]

Has FFG been notified of this? I reread the tournament rules on cheating and they have a quote "zero tolerance" policy. Which is exactly what they should have. His actions clearly qualify as "sleight of hand" cheating. Players like that should be banned from competitive events.

[Ywingscum]

I pkay with honour and expect it from others. I wouldn't have caught it because I can't understand why someone would cheat. This person definitely should be banned from tournaments. Funny he plays eldar, in lore dont Eldar hold honour high?

[BuzzsawMF]

So since that makes all of his Eldorath matches obsolete imo, does that mean that Kith is still bomb diggity?

[TheHiveTyrant]

I've yet to give this a watch, but if it's true, then this is profoundly disappointing.

Edit: after taking a look, this is awfully damning. Good lord.

[sammann11]

"SHAME! SHAME! SHAME! SHAME!"