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Android: Netrunner LCG
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Shoot the Moon
Today, 08:59 AM by Copydawg
Data & Destiny's SYNC seems like the perfect deck to use this imo... with 3 creds per tag, it'll be significantly harder for the runner to shake those tags. With more tagging cards like Data Raven, SEA Source, Big Brother, etc it could rez up 2-3 big glacial ice
Today, 08:44 AM by bozfoogle
Very true, but there's nothing that says you need to play this card in Weyland
Today, 08:30 AM by bozfoogle
Not to the best of my knowledge. I know that they already had the first few data packs designed at the time of core set's release, so I guess they were just preempting any potential problems by putting that in the rules.
Today, 08:19 AM by KillerShrike
To some extent, but Weyland generally doesn't play super horizontal like that; at least not in my experience. Weyland's econ usually comes primarily from operations and perhaps some money making agendas, and the few actually useful assets used are generally worth icing up a bit.
Today, 08:14 AM by KillerShrike
Interesting. I was not aware of that rule. Does any card other than Sat Uplink expose more than 1 card as a single effect?
Today, 07:57 AM by bozfoogle
I have to disagree with Meadbeard and KillerShrike on this one.
Page 22 of the rulebook says "If multiple cards are exposed by one effect they are considered to be exposed simultaneously." There is only one effect on Satellite Uplink - that of exposing two cards. Unfortunately you can't look at one target before choosing the other.
Today, 07:42 AM by bozfoogle
It depends on your intended play style. If you're going to play glacier and only have one or two remotes then this is a pretty bad card, but if you're going to make a lot of remotes that the runner needs to check then I think you could get some decent value out of this.
Yesterday, 08:18 PM by Meadbeard
I don't think Crick is a deterrent to the Runner at all. On the contrary, it's an invitation, which is its strength.
So, if you're considering both, I'd strongly recommend Allele Repression as well, so you can play HQ shell games during the Archives runs, which will allow you to move your traps around and install some things out of HQ (effectively -- you move them to Archives first) without spending clicks. This kind of approach can really raise the value of Celebrity Gift, for example, since the Runner won't know what they're running even after you've just shown it to them.
Keep in mind that Allele Repression recycles other copies of itself, so you can keep the shell game going for the entire game. A single Shi.Kyu, for example, can bounce between Archives and HQ on a per-turn basis, as you trash advanced Allele Repression(s), etc.
This is also a really good way to refresh your face-down cards in Archives, BTW.
Yesterday, 08:09 PM by AdorablePython
Well, cards that have been previously trashed. Mostly assets and upgrades. Though I sometimes trash an Agenda and a couple of ICE by playing Reuse, to gain money and push the trash cost of existing assets/upgrades. I'm leaning towards both, Crick and Shock, but am always open to other views. As I tend to evolve a tunnel vision, which is harmful. Right now I want to capitalize the recursion, as well as a tax for running archives. I think 2-3 Cricks are not that deterrent to the runner.
Yesterday, 08:05 PM by Meadbeard
You're on a roll, mate.
Obviously the Corp isn't rezzing it during an Account Siphon.
As I stated, running through this before you play an Account Siphon is a nice way to pump the Corp's coffers to give the Runner a little something to aim for.
There are plenty of times a Runner might be sitting on A.S. waiting to maximize the gain, only to see the Corp blow through credits turn after turn. Cards like this one (or, say, Sundew) are a real bonus, especially if the Corp has already rezzed this (only to have it broken, by, I dunno, an Eater?).
Using this well will require some excellent timing by the Corp, and it's completely dependent on the Runner's deck. That's not really Hedge Fund. Runner has the initiative here, almost completely, although there is some jank the Corp could pull to ensure the 4 credit net.
So if the answer is "well, don't rez it in fear of a coming Account Siphon," I'd argue that's not, perhaps, a really reliable or stable economy card. Granting initiative to a credit-denial deck regarding your economy? That's got to be the worst move a Corp player can make, so this is, at best, a dead draw against one of the most popular tournament archetypes.
So, no, not a Strawman. This will be fun to run through right before an Account Siphon. I expect to do that the first time I see it and the last time I see it, and so will everybody else.
Yesterday, 07:41 PM by Meadbeard
I wasn't actually addressing anyone in particular there, but since you've taken a stance, here you go:
"i'd gladly pay 4c to steal that agenda the corp was trying to score"
The same could be said of any taxing ICE. Taxing ICE isn't really there to protect agendas. If you're seeing that as a Runner, the Corp is doing it wrong. The point is to tax you before you get to the NAPD. If you still have enough cash that that spend doesn't make an impact, you're winning anyway, so the Corp has no worries.
The Runner will happily run through a Pup (or even a Swordsman) or click through an Eli to score an Agenda. Pop-up Window? Useless. Data Raven? So what?
The list can go on, but it doesn't matter. Taxing ICE doesn't protect Agendas; it taxes the Runner, slowing him or her down in some way, which is a good thing, since the Runner will eventually get past any other ETR ICE the Corp puts down.
Like all taxing ICE, I'd use this on Central Servers as part of an overall strategy. If the Runner is top-decking an NAPD early after paying 4 to get through this, (8 total), I actually like my chances, since that NAPD didn't just win the game. What it did do was have a major impact on the Runner's economy (gosh, I hope -- it's early), so why don't we hang out a bit and see where this game ends I'm not trying to win 7-0, expecting no Agendas will be stolen.
Yesterday, 07:29 PM by Meadbeard
What are you trying to achieve? Shock is probably at its most dangerous in Archives for IG. Crick installs cards out of Archives, so I'd assume that you're installing something else. What?
Yesterday, 07:26 PM by Meadbeard
That's true of any "simultaneous" effect. You do one thing at a time and choose the order according to Timing Priority.
Regarding the question about Blackguard, according to the FAQ, the Runner exposes both cards first, then chooses the order of the Blackguard effect (so can pick the second exposed card to be rezzed first).
Yesterday, 07:21 PM by Meadbeard
By revealing, you showed it to the Runner; ergo, face-up into Archives.
Yesterday, 07:10 PM by Meadbeard
Play it, then trash it to Archives, like any other Operation. The first one is a free credit (you should only ever play 1 on a given turn).
At the beginning of a your turn following a turn in which the Runner did not run, you may add this back to HQ from Archives -- all card text is active in Archives unless an exception is made on the card. Things like Fetal AI and Snare are exceptions, and these exceptions are stated on the cards. You might not be able to do certain things with cards, because they're not installed (Junebug, for example, cannot have tokens added to it), but the text is active.
It doesn't even matter how Subliminal Messaging got into Archives -- maybe you never played it at all, but the Corp just discarded it, or it got trashed out of R&D by milling . . . doesn't matter. You may add it to HQ at the beginning of your turn if the Runner didn't run last turn, full stop.
The is no need for an Asset version: Pad Campaign already exists. The point here is recursion.
Yesterday, 05:47 PM by AdorablePython
When revealing the second/third copy from your hand, is that card going faceup or -down into archives?
Yesterday, 05:02 PM by kleinhusten
So i can peek under my first target, before i select the second one?
That's neat, didn't realize that before. Thanks!
Yesterday, 04:44 PM by KillerShrike
No. The runner is the active player, and thus gets to choose the order in which they expose up to two cards.
Yesterday, 03:33 PM by kleinhusten
They will be exposed simultaneously, right?
Assuming you have a Blackguard installed, which ICE must be rezzed if the corp can only afford one of those?
Yesterday, 02:45 PM by KillerShrike
Yeah. Valdemart has his finger on it. If the runner is making that many successful runs to make this card generate real $, you've also got real game-losing problems.
The thing with currents is that the value of each of them rises and falls with all the others. Some of them have higher intrinsic value, but if both the runner and the corp are playing currents then the value of the strong currents is reduced, while the value of weaker opposing side currents increases (because they turn each other off). They are non-orthogonal and share a fulcrum point that causes them to reach a natural but volatile equilibrium with each other.
In a vacuum this current isn't that good. But if your opponent is playing a current, and you can turn it off with this current, suddenly it just got some extra value in that particular match up. And early on it was the only in-faction option, so Weyland would have had to use this, lag time, or spend influence to engage in that arms race. But even with all of that this card still wasn't good enough to play, probably because people didn't jump on the currents band wagon and there wasn't a compelling reason to play a weaker current with the idea that you would cancel an opponent's current. The early runner currents in particular were pretty meh, which contributed to the lack of impact.
Runner currents have been seeing a bit more play, thanks to Hacktivist and to a lesser extent Traffic Jam. So the weaker corp currents start to look better. But Weyland now has Housekeeping which can be cruel, and Lag Time is still generally a better comparative econ option over this as it will basically cost the runner $1 per ice they encounter on average which is more likely to result in better net credit difference for Weyland.
As I see it there are basically two saving graces for this card.
1) if you are playing core-set Weyland, this is a transaction and makes you an extra $ per copy played. Not major but not nothing either.
2) if you are playing a SEA Source tag & bag deck and are running porous ice on purpose as you want the runner to make successful runs at least some of the time, then this card can help gain you the necessary credit advantage to fund the kill combo.
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