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How to beat Zarathur?

Zarathur Chaos

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30 replies to this topic

#1
sniprpenguin

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Considering that Zarathur seems to be picking up in popularity and power, I was wondering if anyone had playstyle or warlord suggestions for beating the High Sorceror.

 

Every time I've faced against him recently, he just seems to be really good. Massive amounts of damage at instant speed, Temptations and good command really hosed the Worr deck I've been playing recently to the point where I'm not sure if it was just a bad match-up to begin with or if I was just supremely out-played.



#2
sammann11

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Nazdreg is a good choice. Big butts that can absorb the dmg and since they're heartier and can survive some of these dmg bursts they can use their wounds to power brutal

Also SM and Eldar do ok due to generally high HP units
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#3
Skaak

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Worr vs. Zarathur is generally considered a bad matchup for Worr; Zarathur is too good at spreading damage around before combat even starts and has some very nice anti-swarm options, which help to negate Worr's advantage of efficiently pumping out a ton of small units. This is actually one of the reasons Zarathur is getting more popular, in all likelihood. Worr's so darn hard to counter otherwise.

 

I'm not nearly as widely played as a lot of people here, but my worst matchups for Zarathur tend to be Space Marines (any warlord). They've got decent health units, lots of nice combat tricks (ambush and Indomitable are both really hard for Zarathur to deal with, for instance), and Cato can fuel his whole economy off Zarathur's small-health units while Ragnar can throw a serious wrench in Zarathur's ability to participate in key battles (and bloodying Zarathur is usually all but an assured victory, because decks are usually built to rely heavily on his warlord ability; bonus points if you can bloody him with a Plague Beast in his warlord train--that's hilariously horrible for Zarathur).

 

Kith can also be a problem, as she is for most decks, since while Zarathur has decent access to command he's not very well-suited to sniping and choking can prevent him from being able to lay down sufficient damage before battle properly starts, which is something he relies heavily on.

 

I haven't played against them much myself, but I imagine Eldorath would probably cause issues for Zarathur, too, since he can kneel key cards like the Flamers before they get a chance to do their thing, recur units that just died, etc.

 

I've had mixed luck playing against Zarathur with Tyranids (primarly OOE). Tyranids are very good at sniping (Lictor, SWP, and Blazing Zoanthrope are all great at sniping command in different fashions), so if they can weather the first turn they can often turn the command game against Zarathur, and they have some pretty decent health units which is always cause for alarm for Zarathur. They mostly lack reliable combat tricks, though, unlike Space Marines.


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#4
Asklepios

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Zarathur's control is almost entirely damage based, and he hates to have to spend big (in cards or resources) to achieve that control. Zarathur/DE can access Archon's Terror, but I'm of the firm belief that Zarathur and Ammo Depot is such a strong combo that orks are the best allies.

 

He's at his best when he can use one card to take out multiple cards, like a Plaguebeast or Warpstorm, or even a Flamers that attacks then sacrifices.

 

He's at his worst when he has to use multiple cards or a lot of resources to take out a single target. HP-Resilient units are his nightmare.

 

Playing as Zarathur I've often had to bite the bullet and throw big ass Firestorms at a Shrieking Harpy or a Land Raider, simply because I have no other option. This is always, always painful.

 

Cato is also a hard match up. While sacrificing doesn't trigger his warlord ability, there's a tendency for him to present a small number of good units in a fight, and to have just the right number of shields to save them from destruction. Also, surprise units can result in a bloodied Zarathur, which makes it hard to risk attacking with Flamers before sacrificing. Also, Zaraswarm (the best Zara archetype, in my mind) is happiest when using Ammo Depots for draw and hammering Osus and similar planets for the resources. This means that to play its own ideal game, it has to let Cato play HIS ideal game, which is dominating command at Elouith and pulling cards fast. I've learnt the hard way that as Zarathur you HAVE to give up the usual focus on resources and instead block Cato's draw.

 

Kith, incidentally, is probably one of the warlords where I'm happy to be playing Zarathur. Its very satisfying to wipe out a bunch of Khymera at once, or to watch as the Kith player keeps trying his choke game in the face of ammo depots. DE units are low HP with decent attack values generally, and that's Zarathur's preferred target: he can dish out a load of damage before attacks even begin.

 

Orks can be troublesome because of their HP, but on the other hand Zarathur makes Snakebite Thugs double-punch themselves in the face, and makes their Ork Kannon weaker. His low hand size makes Smasha easier to deal with. 

 

So in short, to beat Zarathur, bring a unit which has lots of HP, or just play Cato. 


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#5
Majestaat

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Nullify

#6
VonWibble

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Zarathur is squishy. He has 6 hp and tends to be quite predictable in where he commits. Use that to your advantage and you are a long way to beating him.

Then add in what Asklepios said.
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#7
Etaywah

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Zarathur is squishy. He has 6 hp and tends to be quite predictable in where he commits. Use that to your advantage and you are a long way to beating him.

Then add in what Asklepios said.

 

 

'Ard Boyz have done quite a bit to mitigate that issue.


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#8
Skyknight

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Every time I've faced against him recently, he just seems to be really good. Massive amounts of damage at instant speed, Temptations and good command really hosed the Worr deck I've been playing recently to the point where I'm not sure if it was just a bad match-up to begin with or if I was just supremely out-played.

You might want to try Baharroth. All that pre-combat damage is useless if your half of the field is empty when it happens.

 

Go for both Wildriders, Starcannons, Jetbikes and Wraithguards to pilot the latter, along with all the usual Eldar stuff like Gift of Isha, Seer's Exodus, Doom, Warlock Destructor and maybe the Deathly Web Shrine.

 

As for allies I personally prefer DE with Terror, Sslyths and Gut and Pillage, but Tau with Drone Defence on the Wildrider/Trailblazer and Earth Caste Technicians works fine as well.


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#9
sammann11

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You might want to try Baharroth. All that pre-combat damage is useless if your half of the field is empty when it happens.

 

Go for both Wildriders, Starcannons, Jetbikes and Wraithguards to pilot the latter, along with all the usual Eldar stuff like Gift of Isha, Seer's Exodus, Doom, Warlock Destructor and maybe the Deathly Web Shrine.

 

As for allies I personally prefer DE with Terror, Sslyths and Gut and Pillage, but Tau with Drone Defence on the Wildrider/Trailblazer and Earth Caste Technicians works fine as well.

not to sound like an ass at all but does Zara really care about pre=dmg combat? I always find that most of his dmg is dolled out during combat. But yeah, wildriders and jet bikes can get around a lot


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#10
FightingWalloon

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Piloted my Bonesinger Baharroth deck against Zarathur tonight. Squishy elves don't like all the direct damage Zara can throw out. It does not matter if you can zip around. Eventually, you have to stand in front of him and fight. Game went to planet seven, but I had nothing that had a chance of dislodging him by the time the game got there.


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#11
Dietzen

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not to sound like an ass at all but does Zara really care about pre=dmg combat? I always find that most of his dmg is dolled out during combat. But yeah, wildriders and jet bikes can get around a lot

Avoiding a gleeful 2 dmg ae is a good start
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#12
FightingWalloon

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Avoiding a gleeful 2 dmg ae is a good start

 

Mobile can run away from Gleeful, but if you actually need to fight at the planet where GPB is, you have to mobile in before the blast goes off.


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#13
Dietzen

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Deleted

#14
sammann11

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Mobile can run away from Gleeful, but if you actually need to fight at the planet where GPB is, you have to mobile in before the blast goes off.


This was my point. Mobile units that need to beat Zara, not run from him, aren't going to avoid GPB

#15
Dietzen

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This was my point. Mobile units that need to beat Zara, not run from him, aren't going to avoid GPB

Hmm, both happen at start of combat right?

#16
FightingWalloon

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Hmm, both happen at start of combat right?

 

Mobile is at the start. GPB fires after the start. So you mobile first and then do the GPB damage.



#17
Dietzen

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Mobile is at the start. GPB fires after the start. So you mobile first and then do the GPB damage.

Well crap. Been too long since playing against him I guess.

#18
alanbdg

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Play Ku'Gath



#19
Skyknight

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not to sound like an ass at all but does Zara really care about pre=dmg combat? I always find that most of his dmg is dolled out during combat.

Hehe, that depends on the setup of course. And a hunter-Baharroth with some Shrouded Kamikaze-Harlequins can bloody Zarathur quickly :)

 

Mobile can run away from Gleeful, but if you actually need to fight at the planet where GPB is, you have to mobile in before the blast goes off.

Not quite - with the Wildrider combo (or Jetbike combo) you won't have to move in during mobile :)

 

The Starcannon-tricked out Vyper moves together with the Squadron (or the Wraithguard/Shrouded Harlequin on Jetbike) at action speed, dodging both the Plague Beast, the Mark of Chaos-carrying runt which dies to the Plague Beast and sets off 2x damage to all your units, and the Staff of Chaos carrying unit(s) that sets off 2/3 damage to one of your units etc.


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#20
ellonellanfair

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Save your promotions. Put it on your best combatants that need to survive the warpstorm. AM can dislodge the PB with IF. Zara's command icons are in the middle (only packing 3x 2 for 2) but compensated by Tempation. Hence, he can be outcommanded by high command decks. AM does have a hard time against him, but need to time the post warpstorm tech (Troop Transports, Taurox, Elysians) to win. Shadowsun laughs at warpstorms. Eldar has nullify, DE can win on command and choke if there's no ammo depot, otherwise, protect combatants with promotion. SM is just to sturdy including Orks. 

 

I guess it's been said already, a bloodied Zara is almost GG as all his AoE effects become paltry and to his detriment (1/5 bloodied side). Ardboyz did mitigate that but they are great targets for removal.

 

Zara also relies heavily on ammo depot and drawing cards. Destroy that ammo depot and he'll have to fight for card planets.







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