Sword-thain

So far I've felt like there is not really enough interactions that only target heroes that make this a better card than just running resourceful.  You are paying 4 to gain an extra resource each turn.  I feel the best use of this card is to play it from a support deck or one that generates a lot of resources itself and then gives this to a partner to help with their resource generation.  I have a trap/victory display deck that gets a ton of resources, and this card would be great to give to my tactics friend to put on their Legolas ally or something similar.  

So far I've felt like there is not really enough interactions that only target heroes that make this a better card than just running resourceful.  You are paying 4 to gain an extra resource each turn.  I feel the best use of this card is to play it from a support deck or one that generates a lot of resources itself and then gives this to a partner to help with their resource generation.  I have a trap/victory display deck that gets a ton of resources, and this card would be great to give to my tactics friend to put on their Legolas ally or something similar.  

Agreed. As a support economy card I get it (especially if one player's rocking Steward). But otherwise...it's just too expensive. If I have a great ally on the board and 4 resources...I would probably rather just have another ally or two rather than a economy bump that won't pay out for another 5 turns. 

I see Sword-thain as better for resource smoothing than for resource acceleration. If you have a deck with two Leadership heroes and one Spirit hero, and you're struggling to pay for your Spirit cards because you put Steward of Gondor on a Leadership hero, well, use your plentiful Leadership resources to Sword-thain Arwen Undómiel into a second Spirit hero*. Now you're getting two Spirit resources per turn instead of one, and you spent your plentiful Leadership resources, not your meager Spirit resources, on making that happen.

* This example would have been better if I had written it when Sword-thain was spoiled but hero-Arwen was not... :-)

For solo play, I see 3 great possibilties with this :

1- 4 hero with the 4 spheres

2- super secrecy : start with only 2 heroes, and later end up with 3 heroes, always in super low threat

3- 4 heroes sharing the same trait, taking advantage of the trait's support cards (Noldor, Rangers, Hobbits with tactics Merry attacking for 4!)

I see Sword-thain as better for resource smoothing than for resource acceleration. If you have a deck with two Leadership heroes and one Spirit hero, and you're struggling to pay for your Spirit cards because you put Steward of Gondor on a Leadership hero, well, use your plentiful Leadership resources to Sword-thain Arwen Undómiel into a second Spirit hero*. Now you're getting two Spirit resources per turn instead of one, and you spent your plentiful Leadership resources, not your meager Spirit resources, on making that happen.

 

* This example would have been better if I had written it when Sword-thain was spoiled but hero-Arwen was not... :-)

Oh I definitely agree that  in a bind like that you would be delighted to draw Sword-Thain--I just don't get into that situation enough to warrant adding it to my decks. If I have a ton of resources and no cards to spend it on it's usually because I made a mistake (either in the deck-build or in the gameplay).  

It is an interesting option, though, for some resource smoothing. Combined with it's combo potential as a Hero-maker I can see it potentially  working well in decks that already have some resource acceleration or discounting going on to help swallow the costs. 

For solo play, I see 3 great possibilties with this :

 

1- 4 hero with the 4 spheres

2- super secrecy : start with only 2 heroes, and later end up with 3 heroes, always in super low threat

3- 4 heroes sharing the same trait, taking advantage of the trait's support cards (Noldor, Rangers, Hobbits with tactics Merry attacking for 4!)

1) Quad-Sphere deck is interesting but getting a decent ally (of a sphere you do not have a match for) can be tricky. Might take up too much room in your deck to make it effective once you pull it off. And if you can't get it on quick you are going to be looking at a lot of dead cards. Might work well in a Noldor-discard deck though? 

2) Well, you could but you would almost have to get Resourceful out first or it would seriously hurt your resource-tempo. And then it's only giving you one extra...Stewards better if you have any Leadership. Might let you go Tri-sphere later in the game but again you are looking at dead cards if you can't pull it off quick and with 2 heroes you don't have a lot of room for dead-draws. 

3) This is probably the best use for this card--especially the Hobbits. I still think it's expensive but tri-sphere Hobbit decks are common enough that they are likely already running both resource acceleration and discounts to help pay for it. Sword-Thain will hurt their resource tempo but in a deck like that the resource smoothing might be worth it and Hobbit synergy is real. Biggest problem there is just that your available Hobbit allies aren't amazing. New Sam maybe?

Just talked about this with @Lecitadin over on the Brok Ironfist page but it's more relevant here. 

Does anyone know if this combos with Sneak Attack to potentially keep the Ally--now Hero--in play? 

If so then it completely changes my estimation of this card and any deck running Sneak Attack for anyone except Gandalf should probably have at least 2x. It also significantly increases the stock of Hero and OHaUH Gandalf as you now have better targets for those Sneak Attacks than Core Gandalf.

But...I don't know. The use of "that" in Sneak Attack's language could imply that the return effect is not contingent on the card's status as an Ally. And I just feel like the devs didn't necessarily mean for it to be quite that easy to pull off. 5 resources to put any non-neutral Ally into play as a hero (with everything that goes along with that)...

And if that was unintentional I am a little worried that it get's errated in such a way that Allies brought into play by effects like Elf-Stone and Vilya will also be removed as viable targets...which would seriously hurt this card. 

I don't know--any thoughts?

I sent a rules request about the Sneak Attack / Sword-Thain combo because, while it doesn´t rub me quite right, I could find no logical reason why it wouldn´t work.

And quite right, I got a response saying that it is a valid combo.

Still though it does require the right combination of cards in your hand: Sneak Attack, Sword-Thain and the ally in question (though if you deckbuild for it you might have included a few allies who can pick up the mantle)

Well-equiped also makes it possible to attach Sword-thain FOR FREE to a unique dwarf ally.

But it's not an OP card, because you need :
1- to draw it
2- to have the right ally at the right moment
3- to have the resources without a combo

Well-equiped also makes it possible to attach Sword-thain FOR FREE to a unique dwarf ally.

 

But it's not an OP card, because you need :
1- to draw it
2- to have the right ally at the right moment
3- to have the resources without a combo

Gandalf, Wizard's Pipe, Gildor or Imladris Stargazer all make this easier to accomplish. With Word of Command, it becomes stupid-easy (assuming you have an Istari in play, obviously). 

The Sneak attack really changes things for this card. If you can play out a 5-cost ally you are now getting an extra resource every turn for the rest of the game for free. That's on a level with effects like Gloin/Self Preservation and almost as good as Steward. 

I'm pretty certain the sneak attack+sword thain has been confirmed on the FFG forums.  It works since the ally is no longer in play.

A few allies to consider for this :

There's already a lot of in-sphere ways of standing Faramir without UC. I feel Legolas is one of the better choices for Sword-thain to get a Rohan horse on him and get more reliable draw going.

I kind of prefer Sneak Attacking him normally but don't forget Gwaihir as a possible option in an Eagle deck. That extra Tactics resource every turn will help you get those high-cost Eagles on the board a lot faster.

Not to mention in an Eagles deck you are more likely to be running Radagast so if you have some Lore running around you could Word of command for whatever piece of the combo you were missing. 

And could Radagast's resources be used to pay for Sword-Thain? I mean, they're neutral...

Also...an Eagle hero would just be awesome. 

Hmm... AnEagle hero.. yes! And yes, Legolas would be a nice card drawing hero!

This just got a huge bump from new Imrahil--will work just as well as Sneak Attack and you won't need to draw into it.

As an attachment that you can't play during the combat phase - which is what Imrahil is restricted to - the only way this works is with a Well Equipped or Vilya cheating it into play in the combat phase.

As an attachment that you can't play during the combat phase - which is what Imrahil is restricted to - the only way this works is with a Well Equipped or Vilya cheating it into play in the combat phase.

Damn--you're right of course. Totally missed that new Imrahil is a Combat Action. Ah well...

In a saga hobbit deck this can give you 5 hobbit heros (ideally 1 of each sphere + ringbearer frodo)...combined with resourceful & steward, even a 4 sphere deck can run very efficiently. Not to mention that hobbit synergy is some of the best synergy in the game.