Jump to content

Welcome to Card Game DB
Register now to gain access to all of our features. Once registered and logged in, you will be able to create topics, post replies to existing threads, give reputation to your fellow members, get your own private messenger, post status updates, manage your profile and so much more. If you already have an account, login here - otherwise create an account for free today!

Search Articles

* * * * *

Honor, Profit, and Net Damage

Android: Netrunner Hraklea

Everybody loves the bluffing aspect of Android: Netrunner. If you never "junebug'ed" anyone (or got "junebug'ed" yourself), you're missing a huge fun part of what playing Android: Netrunner really is. So, go ahead and throw yourself into an ambush. I'll wait.

[...]

Ok, now that everyone knows how usings ambushes (often miscalled as "traps" - remember: trap is a piece of ICE subtype, the correct assets subtype is ambush) is important in this game, it is time to understand how these cards are intended to play. I often see people buying terribles bluffs, and even more often I see people including ambushes in their decks that no one that knows the game should be falling to.

I remember that back when I joined the CardGameDB.com team, I had a huge debate with another user who claimed that Runners should always facecheck unrezzed remote servers, no matter what. I tried to explain that diving into a two advancement ambush when you're playing against a "Tag'n Bag" deck wasn't a smart move, but due his misconceptions about game theory, he thought that this was an actual good move.

The Math Behind a Bluff

Today, I want to introduce you the concept of "mixed strategies", but first things first. When we talk about game theory, it is important to understand what is a game for mathematicians. Every struggle between two or more players is a "game" - in our case, the match is not a game, but every click is a separated game that's played over and over and that will eventually stop being played (when someone wins the Android: Netrunner match). The idea of mixed strategies is that you'll "mix" your different options from game to game in order to end up with the best result, on average.

I'll give you an example. Let's say I'm playing soccer, and my friend is taking penalty kicks on me. He has two options, kick left or kick right; I have two options, defend left or defend right (yes, I'm simplifying the problem for the sake of the example). So, what can he do to maximize his score? It is easy to see that, if he chooses one side and kick there everytime, I'll block all kicks - I'll always block the same side too. He has to "mix" his strategies up, kicks sometimes to one side, and sometimes to the other side.

(It can be math'ly proved that the best strategy is 50/50 for both players, but the results itself is not as important as your understanding of the concept, so I won't show you the calculations. If you're really curious about it, google "Nash equilibrium in mixed strategies".)

The Bluff Behind a Piece of ICE

Just like kicking always to the same side is one of the worst strategy my friend can follow, your traps will not work while ignoring your remotes is the best strategy for the Runner. That's why nobody uses these things in a fast advance deck - because a fast advance deck would never "install-advance-advance" an agenda. What you want are those cards that wait for the best moment to be rezzed: like Ronin, Project Ares, and my new BFF, Vulcan Coverup.

It simply wasn't worth to run on a remote server against Jinteki back in the Core Set days because anything that's has two advancement tokens and was not scored is obviously an ambush. Now, it can be a Ronin. Now, ignoring remotes is not the best strategy against Jinteki anymore, because not trashing a Ronin might lead the Runner to a flatline. And that's why it is important to advance your Project Junebug 4 times as fast as possible: because its job is not to pretend to be an agenda, but to pretend to be a Ronin.

When Geoff Hollis said that you're goal as a Jinteki player was to rush to the match point, what he was really saying is that, if you want your ambushes to work, you must force the Runner to take a mixed strategy by manipulating the game and making a mixed strategy (sometimes ignoring remotes and sometimes running remotes) the optimal strategy for the Runner.

"Is that a Cerebral Overwritter or is it a Vulcan Coverup waiting for a Scorched Earth to kill me?"

"Is that an Aggressive Secretary or a Project Atlas waiting for me to install my last program to wipe my rig?"

The Emptyness Behind the Threat

Let's be fair: the old member who argued with me wasn't completely wrong. Sometimes, bad bluffers will try to bluff with things that are not good for themselves - we call that a "non-credible threat". This is a little weird concept to explain if you don't have all the math background required, so I'll break it to make it as simple as possible:

1. People are rational and they'll always make the move that's optimal for them;
2. You threat someone that, unless they do something you want, I will follow the X strategy;
3. Following the X strategy is worse for you than following the Y strategy;
4. You're rational, so you'll always follows Y over X;
5. People know you are rational so you won't follow the X strategy, you'll always follow Y strategy;
6. People won't believe in your threat.

If you have to make a non-optimal moves in order to bluff, you're doing it wrong. Making non-optimal moves, well... is not optimal for you. What you should be doing is to design your strategy in some way that baiting the Runner into a trap happens to be your optimal move.

There are several cases of non-credible threats in Android: Netrunner. A good example would be to use a 2 advancement Project Junebug to threat a Runner with 5 cards in his or her hands when you don't have enough credits to play the Neural EMP that would be necessary to flatline the Runner. The Runner will see that it would be a waste of an ambush, and that it is not the optimal move for you, and will run it.

You might be thinking "hey, but if the Runner gets into the trap that way, it is good for me!". Yes, it is better to you that the Runner gets hit by a trap rather than steals an agenda. But the issue is that it still is not an optimal move, even if it hits, and that's what it makes it a bad move. It is an empty threat not because it is not a threat at all, but because a rational person would not do it (once again, because it is not an optimal move).

Thanks, Von Neumann!

I hope all of this makes sense to you. These game theory concepts might not be very intuitive if you're not familiar with this sort of math, so feel free to ask anything you might not have understood. If you want me to talk about anything in particular, you're welcome to ask it too.

Good luck, good bluffs, and good waiting on the Double Time spoiler. Posted Image

João “Hraklea” Almeida is a brazilian amateur card game player, the responsible for the Android: Netrunner league in Porto Alegre - RS -, in partnership with Lojas Jambô, and the writer of Root Cause, a bi-weekly series of articles about playing Anarch.
  • scantrell24, kurthl33t and ashtaroth like this


21 Comments

Good article. Of course an "optimal" and "sub-optimal" move aren't always so easily recognizable. And something that 9 times out of 10 isn't optimal can become so depending on the situation. Your opponent being broke, etc.
But then again, maybe that's what makes a person a good Netrunner player. Being able to judge correctly whether a move is optimal or not.
Errata "Is that an Aggressive Secretary or a Project Atlas Ares waiting for me to install my last program to wipe my rig?"

Sorry about that.
Nice article. Although the example of "a two-advanced card isn't really that dangerous if the Runner has many cards on hand and you can't play EMP" isn't quite true anymore, since Cerebral Overwriter is a goodie.

On the other hand, a serious mistake I see many would-be trap-makers doing is mismanaging their economy. Say the Corp has four creds, a well-defended HQ (rezzed ice), a defended R&D (unrezzed ice) and an unprotected, double-advanced card in a remote. At this point, if I were the Runner I'd usually just go bananas on R&D - either they let me have four back-to-back free runs on R&D, or they botch their trap; if they rez any (non-minor) ice or fire off any Snare! that I might find, they can no longer afford to fire their trap. Mix the possibility of Account Siphon/Vamp into the mix, and suddenly you can safely disarm a surprising number of traps, or force the Corp to do it for you.
    • Hraklea and PeekaySK like this
Bluffing is very difficult. Specially if you play against very cautious players. I believe a deck that wants to make a strong use of its ambushes also has to have a good plan on getting to match point, since then, the Runner will be pressured to run almost anything you advance, to avoid the game loss. The Jinteki art is difficult to master, but very satisfying if done right. But in the end, the most difficult part is conveying to the Runner that you're doing an optimal play, but not showing him that the play is an ambush set-up.
Using the example of the penalty kicking, one could argue, that the strategy of kicking three times to the right is also a "mixed" one, as you force the goal-keeper to think "He won't shoot three times to the same side, right? He's not that stupid!?". Hence begins the bluff. But maybe I'm getting it wrong.

As always a great article and something to keep on the back of the mind whilst deckbuilding!
    • Hraklea likes this

Using the example of the penalty kicking, one could argue, that the strategy of kicking three times to the right is also a "mixed" one, as you force the goal-keeper to think "He won't shoot three times to the same side, right? He's not that stupid!?". Hence begins the bluff. But maybe I'm getting it wrong.


You're getting it right. If you're going to kick 50% chance to each side, there is a 12.5% chance that all kicks are going to be to the same side, it is a valid result in a mixed strategy game. I remember once when some guy was running my HQ, and I managed to "shuffle" my HQ in a way that he accessed the same card 6 times in a row.
    • Kahiron and ashtaroth like this
"and I managed to "shuffle" my HQ in a way that he accessed the same card 6 times in a row"

Basically. that is cheating you are supposed to provide random chance
Photo
therealwarrior
Apr 02 2014 09:39 AM
You forgot one essential point in your demonstration, Hraklea: that Nash Equilibria are rarely optimal.
They are the best strategy to follow if every players follow the same strategy. And that is why the "three times to the right" strategy can be efficient, depending on the strategy your opponent follows.
Nash Equilibria is as follows for soccer.
If I stand to the right, the player will kick to the left and vice versa, hence I need to stand at the center so the player has no obvious choice that is better than the other.
The "outcome" of the gameis difference between where I tried to defend and where the ball went...

Basically. that is cheating you are supposed to provide random chance


It was random, I'm not a mind reader, neither I hypnotized my opponent.

I placed all my cards facedown on the board and he picked one. That's not random either (in the strict meaning of "randomness", so my opponent was cheating too. And so where the guys at GenCon, and at the WCW, etc.

While I can guess which card he might pick, it still is random because I can't know for sure which card he's going to pick. You're free to dislike it, but everything suggests that FFG don't consider it cheating.

You forgot one essential point in your demonstration, Hraklea: that Nash Equilibria are rarely optimal.


As I said, I'm not a game theory teacher, and I won't post all the math behind mixed strategy games.

Nash equilibrium is a point of the game where everybody's best strategy is not to chance their strategy, and my example fits it perfectly. Kicking always right is not a Nash equilibrium because, once I decide to always defend right, kicking always right is not your best strategy anymore.

As it is a mixed strategy game, kicking three times to the right will be your best move, but only 12.5% of the time. That is exactly what is implied on the text, and on the Nash equilibrium in mixed strategy games definition. I didn't forget anything.
Photo
therealwarrior
Apr 02 2014 03:59 PM
I wasn't attacking you ;) .
I just wanted to remind you that in many games, the best players don't follow Nash Equilibria, because their opponent doesn't have to follow them neither. The Soccer example is a simple and symetrical problem, and then it works. But NetRunner is a bit more complex to analyse with a Game Theory point of view. You can't divide the problem in many sub-games to fully understand it, because of the dependance between theses sub-games.
Anyway, your article is helpful to remind us that logics and efficiency can work together, even in this nice game.

I just wanted to remind you that in many games, the best players don't follow Nash Equilibria, because their opponent doesn't have to follow them neither.


That's true, the rationality in game theory is just an assumption, and in a tournament where you only play one match, it is hard to find your opponent's pattern (like "he's always kicking right!") that fast.

But it can happen, and if someone finds out your pattern, you're done. I rather not take that chance and play the equilibrium, if I know it.

The Soccer example is a simple and symetrical problem, and then it works. But NetRunner is a bit more complex to analyse with a Game Theory point of view.


You're 100% right, it is humanly impossible to calculate the Nash equilibrium of each click on the fly.

My idea when I brough the game theory to the discussion was to show there's is a math logic in bluffing, and that you should understand what you're doing before including ambushes in your deck.
If the player taking the kick is English, and the penalty kick is in the semi/quarter finals of a european/world cup tournament, the keeper will save it 100% of the time. Truefact.
    • ajax013 and ashtaroth like this
I will admit that I know nothing about football history, but I'm assuming you mean that "the keeper saved it 100% of the times it has happened so far"? It's quite dangerous to interpolate probability from previous events, especially if you're not considering the statistical significance.

Not that I'm a statistician, either.

It was random, I'm not a mind reader, neither I hypnotized my opponent.

I placed all my cards facedown on the board and he picked one. That's not random either (in the strict meaning of "randomness", so my opponent was cheating too. And so where the guys at GenCon, and at the WCW, etc.

While I can guess which card he might pick, it still is random because I can't know for sure which card he's going to pick. You're free to dislike it, but everything suggests that FFG don't consider it cheating.


With 2 cards on hand it is 1 to 64; with 5 its 1 to 1600.

The proper way would be to quickly shuffle cards, put them face-down and then let him choose randomly (or the first card, does not matter much).

But going to the article, you make a good point, either way...

I will admit that I know nothing about football history, but I'm assuming you mean that "the keeper saved it 100% of the times it has happened so far"? It's quite dangerous to interpolate probability from previous events, especially if you're not considering the statistical significance.
Not that I'm a statistician, either.


I'm kinda lost here, but I'm pretty sure what you quoted was a joke. :P

With 2 cards on hand it is 1 to 64; with 5 its 1 to 1600.
The proper way would be to quickly shuffle cards, put them face-down and then let him choose randomly (or the first card, does not matter much).
But going to the article, you make a good point, either way...


I have no idea what you meant by "1 to 64". If I have 2 card in HQ, the Runner's chance to access each card is 50%. With 5 cards, it is 20%.

About the randomness, I don't condemn people who roll dices to access HQ, for instance. If they want absolute randomness, that's fine.

But as far as I know, it largely accepted to shuffle the cards and offer a "non-random" distribution for the Runner to pick. The Runner's pick is going to be random, so it doesn't matter if you shuffled HQ or not. I don't want to be rude, but I think you're nitpicking here.
"1. People are rational and they'll always make the move that's optimal for them;
2. You threat someone that, unless they do something you want, I will follow the X strategy;
3. Following the X strategy is worse for you than following the Y strategy;
4. You're rational, so you'll always follows Y over X;
5. People know you are rational so you won't follow the X strategy, you'll always follow Y strategy;
6. People won't believe in your threat."

... Because iocane comes from Australia, as everyone knows, and Australia is entirely peopled with criminals, and criminals are used to having people not trust them, as you are not trusted by me, so I can clearly not choose the wine in front of you.
    • AlexFrost, mbar, CommissarFeesh and 1 other like this

If the player taking the kick is English, and the penalty kick is in the semi/quarter finals of a european/world cup tournament, the keeper will save it 100% of the time. Truefact.

This made my day!

It's quite dangerous to interpolate probability from previous events

Interpolation is usually rather 'safe'. However, you seem to be talking about extrapolation, which is indeed quite risky.

Interpolation is usually rather 'safe'. However, you seem to be talking about extrapolation, which is indeed quite risky.


Sorry. As stated, I'm a mathematician, not a statistician, and it seems the two disciplines use these terms somewhat differently.

... Because iocane comes from Australia, as everyone knows, and Australia is entirely peopled with criminals, and criminals are used to having people not trust them, as you are not trusted by me, so I can clearly not choose the wine in front of you.


Quit quoting Princess Bride, and I mean it!
Of course, if you put it behind some ICE that the runner has to pay to get through, then it *can* be beneficial to install a junebug and advance twice. For example, if you are against a shaper, then you can get them to use a smc to get through your ICE. Even if you don't kill them, you have used up their resources.
    • Hraklea likes this