Card Game DB
Sign In
Create Account
Welcome to Card Game DB
Register now to gain access to all of our features. Once registered and logged in, you will be able to create topics, post replies to existing threads, give reputation to your fellow members, get your own private messenger, post status updates, manage your profile and so much more. If you already have an account, login here - otherwise create an account for free today!
Register now to gain access to all of our features. Once registered and logged in, you will be able to create topics, post replies to existing threads, give reputation to your fellow members, get your own private messenger, post status updates, manage your profile and so much more. If you already have an account, login here - otherwise create an account for free today!
1
The Grand Melee - 5 Most Dangerous Women
Jan 31 2013 06:00 PM |
bigfomlof
in Game of Thrones
Small Council The Grand Melee bigfomlof
Welcome back to The Grand Melee - Psych 101. This installment of Psych 101 is the companion article of last week's (5 Most Dangerous Men) and in it we'll be taking a closer look at the Melee format's 5 most dangerous women. As I stated in the prefatory comments of the previous article, these cards might not be the best of the best, or even the best version of a card as generally accepted here on this site. Regardless, the purpose of these articles is to highlight those cards, tactics or situations whose impact on the psychological landscape of the 4-player Melee is both undeniable and of epic proportions.So, what makes a woman "dangerous"? First, for this particular thread she must be unique--no allies or generic waifs or witches. In most cases, the women of Thrones excel in Intrigue, denial, subterfuge and hidden mechanisms--very few simply bash you in the head and then go drink in the bars with Bronn. Yet, these women change the psychological landscape not because the dangers and threats they pose are more subtle than those of the 5 most dangerous men, but rather because as individuals they kick serious ass, and do so in more interesting and varied ways than the boyish thugs and goons of Westeros (you hear me, Clegane?).
These 5 cards listed below represent, in this humble author's mind, those women in the game who most affect the other players' styles, who change their decisions, who impose, by their very presence, an almost mono-focus on their defeat. Only once in the Dead pile can the others breathe again, and turn back to each others' throats.
5. Arianne Martell (PotS)
4. Brienne of Tarth (PotS)
In Brienne, we have almost the polar opposite of Arianne Martell. Unlike her peer group, Brienne will actually pummel the hell out of you and as she is doing it there is very little you can do to stop it. While pushing a sword down into your privates, she negates the ability for any player to trigger effects, either from characters, attachments , locations or events. Sure, it's only while she's participating, but that's when you need stuff the most. O, and any help you were counting on from your temporary allies is gone, too. Indeed, Brienne the Beauty changes the landscape because though you love it when she's hunting Lannisters across the board, she just might turn her attention to you next time. And then who's laughing?
3. Cersei Lannister (LotR)
I was torn, somewhat, by putting this version of Cersei as low as 3rd on the list, and I suspect that if any of these picks is controversial, it's this one more than the others. Aside from hitting you with an axe, there is very little Cersei Lannister can't do. Every turn she will be attacking at least twice without kneeling, and if she survives even 3 turns I can easily see her personally discarding somewhere between 6-15 cards from the other players' hands. And she does it so easily--she either gives herself Stealth to simply bypass any would-be defenders or Deadly to dare them to defy her.
2. Daenerys Targaryen (GotC)
All hail the Queen of Dragons. Now, this version of Daenerys might not be the most singularly impressive, but it also requires no particular synergistic combo or other cards to be effective. Yes, her standing dragon self is pretty cool, but giving every single Targaryan character +1 strength is, quite simply, globally game-changing for the other 3 players. Add Renown and her Nobility and you have almost the perfect character. All that prevents her from claiming the top spot is that while giving, she does not take away. Which brings us to...
1. Melisandre (Core)
This version of Melisandre is an absolute beast. She gives and she takes in equal measure, and her affect on the landscape of the game is incredible. She pumps up the strength of all those fanatical Asshai crazies and her denial of power can destroy whole strategies. There really isn't much else to say about this one--she speaks for herself in every way possible.
Well, there you have it. I look forward to your comments and suggestions. Who's more dangerous than these? Who's absence is an outrage?
- zordren, Archrono, Seriously and 1 other like this
22 Comments
also think danny probably doesnt even deserve to be on the list, let alone 2.
feel asha or alaynness (probably spelt wrong) should be on the list as well. just my initial thoughts
Your choices are definitely 5 dangerous women, keeping the focus on melee games, I would have made a few different choices. To me, Arianne, Cersei are both amazing characters but they still generally only effect 1 player at a time.
From a melee perspective, here is the list I’d say are the 5 most dangerous that change the way players go about their game:
5: Tie between Brienne and Ellaria Sand (PotS)
Brienne can really mess things up for the opponent you are attacking, but it also stops all opponents from doing much so I can see her definitely being considered for the list. I haven't actually had too many melees with Brienne so I can only imagine her effect on the table, though I would agree it would likely draw some attention. Ellaria, on the other hand, I have had lots of experience with. Once I get her in play it completely discourages other players from attacking me if they are counting on renown. And with the vengeful trait she gets to keep opposing challenges.
4. The Queen of Thorns (TftRK)
She is a power generating engine that doesn’t care if her controller wins challenges or not. As long as she is alive and you have the gold to hop out shadow cards (like Sister of Truth (KotStorm)) then you can win without drawing blood from your opponents. Rightfully so, this will frighten your opponents.
3. Daenerys Targaryen (QoD)
Since dragons are much more prone to pop up in a melee I felt this version of her projects more of a threat than the +1 STR version.
2. Myrcella Lannister (ODG)
There is always a reaction from your opponents when she hits the board and it is never positive. Especially if you can give her Vengeful!
1: Mel (Core)
Completely agree here. This lady needs to die immediately! Or at least, as soon as I have more power than my opponents!
I wanted to put Meera in here, but she kind of fell into the same group as Arienne and Cersei. They are amazing ladies, but still only effect 1 player.
oh hahah i feel dumb (: its for melee lol
Meera Reed (TftH)'s absence is simply wrong.
No Arya Stark (CoS),Catelyn Stark (LoW), Asha Greyjoy (WLL), Alannys Greyjoy (ODG)?
In a melee game, those characters just aren't that threatening to me. Meera Reed certainly can be, but considering she isn't hurting each opponent when you use her, she just isn't as impacting.
I think melisandre core set could be considered "most dangerous" in a melee game. While she's alive, she can keep anyone from winning if they have power all over their characters, so she is impacting every player while she is out.
I don't think I'd include Brienne of Tarth on this list in melee. She is only a threat for one challenge unless you can restand her to use her again. She's still awesome, but I just am not worried about seeing her in a melee game.
Myrcella Lannister is someone my group is annoyed to see when she is put out for sure.
Asha Greyjoy is someone I can see being a threat in melee still because not kneeling to attack is just awesome.
Players in my playgroup don't really like it when I've pulled out Lyanna Stark (ODG), however she's only annoying against non-unique characters.
Oh! And I also think that Arriane Martell belongs on the list. All you need to do is attack the one player that can't beat you and it's 2-3 claim as long as she lives. During a To the Spears round(if you use the plot), she is the most annoying character to be attacked by.
that is a true story (no it was claim 2)
Especially in my meta, Ellaria is top 5. To me, no one comes that close to the hate that core Mel and Mycrella gets though. Arianne is amazing and can definitely push the game in your favor. So with Ellaria and Arianne on your list, who else makes your top 5 Bomb?
As for my last Lady, I really think that it is between Cersei Lannister (LotR) and Asha Greyjoy (WLL) for me. Asha is renown and won't kneel to attack at all(obviously once her condition is met) and Cersei, while only doesn't kneel to attack during INT challenges, has a POW icon and claims 1 power and gains Stealth or Deadly when you win an INT challenge. I like Cersei's icons better and I like the option to get those keywords. However because Asha is renown, I find that to even out the score between them when they are in play. Of course Asha being 1 gold cheaper in-house matters, but for the purposes of this discussion, I find them to be pretty close in danger level.
The Chars you name are powerful, no question. And most of us will include em in every Melee Deck, they fit into. But besides Asha, they are more of Joust chars. Yeah, Alannys cancel is always nice to have in a Melee game, but still not as powerful as others can be, since Melee depends on a good power grab capability.
Concerning the first list:
They are all very Powerful chars! And I bet it was a difficult decision to select the top five. To me It'd be so. Arianne and Cersei, who are awesome in Joust nonetheless, are also really good Melee chars, because if not kept in check, they will get you a nice bunch of power pretty quick. So I can understand, you chose them.
Other Characters, I rate pretty strong are:
- Myrcella Lannister (ODG): Her ability is very very good. Not that nice in a 3 player Melee, but at tournaments, youll play a 4 player game the most time
- Varys (TGM) is even more annoying than Myrcella, though more costy
- Ellaria Sand (PotS): as Myrcella, she's already mentioned above. Nothing left to say bout her, I think. There are a lot of chars, that gain power in Melee. And she will benefit from it.
Imagine a turn where she wins an intrigue challenge, then after determination of challenge winner, returns to hand to send a card like The Blackfish (LoW) to my hand, where it's randomly discarded for claim.
Number 5 with a bullet : Arianne
I claim illegal game state! LOL.
There is no player action available to any player "after determining the winner of a challenge" until after several things have happened. Most importantly, claim. In order to bounce Blackfish before claim, your opponent would have to use their player action opportunity after you declared denders but before determining the winner of the challenge. Then determine winner. If they still won, they still would only have regular claim as Arienne would no longer be participating in the challenge.
I always wondered about this game state situation, as it troubles me. So, all those cards that gain the response "if you lost a challenge, cancel the challenge or the other guy loses" (you know the ones), well, how do they work? I mean, I go through the framework, lose my guys, cards, power, reward renown, deal with deadly and then after all that i get to say, "Just kidding--I'm going to undo all that and now you satisfy claim." That makes no sense to me but it appears to be how it works since there is no player action during the framework.
@mnBronco: I said in the previous article that there would be no Meera--but only because I hate her. Almost as much as I hate the card Hodor.
@Bomb: good point^^ I don't know how I got to Varys...
Under optimal conditions, she can generate 6 power. 3xRenown, 3xFrom Her Passive. However, her passive can be effectively utilized by other characters. Especially in a House that has reasonable access to Stealth, multiple options to stand characters and can win Dominance outright. And especially in Melee where there's bound to be someone who's face is open on Intrigue and/or Power. Best case scenario in melee with 1 Claim, 14 power in one turn. Sounds like a heavy plate but quite frankly, little stops an Asshai deck from winning challenges on a Power of Faith turn. At that point, its how many unopposed challenges and defensive wins you get in the process.